SUBJECTS: Labor’s policy agenda; immigration; quarantine; COVID-19 pandemic; climate change; Labor’s Powering Australia Plan; renewables; Federal election.
 
CHRIS SMITH, HOST: Labor Leader, Anthony Albanese, he's out and about showing Australia what he's made of. But he's making himself a small target, softening the policies of his predecessor, Bill Shorten. And the new approach, well, it doesn't seem like the Labor Party that people might recognise. You take immigration. Anthony Albanese says his Party won't support the Government's plan to bring 160,000 people into the country. Tough on immigration. That doesn't seem like the Labor Party I know. Then you've got coal-fired power. Once upon a time, Labor wanted to shut these stations down. Now, they're saying they'll be allowed to run their course. Plenty to talk about. I'm joined now on the line by Opposition Leader, Anthony Albanese. Albo, welcome.
 
ANTHONY ALBANESE, LEADER OF THE AUSTRALIAN LABOR PARTY: Good morning, Chris. Good to be with you, mate.
 
SMITH: Now, Josh Frydenberg announced over the weekend that the Government wants to bring in 160,000 new migrants a year. But you came out refusing to back the plan. Given what we've lost, tens of thousands of people, it's a very moderate number, isn't it?
 
ALBANESE: Well, they're automatically talking about bouncing back to where the numbers were before. And the point that I've made is that the Government needs to justify that. And secondly, that we need to train Australians. We have massive skill shortages. And one of the things has happened during the pandemic is that it has exposed some of the weaknesses in our economy. Now, we've got 2 million Australians who are either unemployed or underemployed. They say they want more hours. Why aren't we training more Australians for those jobs? That's why we've announced 465,000 free TAFE places in everything from blue-collar work, like electricians and bricklayers that we need in construction, through to areas of the care economy, like nursing and aged care.
 
SMITH: But that is going to take time, isn't it?
 
ALBANESE: It is. But this Government have become too reliant upon temporary migration. We're not training Australians for those jobs so that when the shock happened of the borders closing, which was a necessary action that the Federal Government took, we had found ourselves whereby businesses didn't have enough staff. And temporary migration will always be an important component. But what I'm saying is we need to identify where the shortages are and train Australians for them. If we don't do the planning for it, then we won't give Australians the opportunities to get those good, permanent, secure jobs. And we'll leave businesses vulnerable to shocks that might occur in the future.
 
SMITH: Fair enough. But I'm hearing from businesses who are just wanting someone to serve at a table, to deliver meals, to pull beers, that they can't find people to work for them. It's almost as if we're at full employment, people don't want a job at 4.8 per cent.
 
ALBANESE: Well, no, that's not right. It is correct that many businesses are struggling to get those people because a lot of people who filled those jobs, of course, was the education sector that's been locked out, people who were backpackers travelling, doing some casual work while they were here. And we need to bring those people back. I've been arguing, Chris, for a long period of time, for the last two years, for goodness sake, get purpose-built quarantine right, get Australian citizens home, make sure that we can bring Australians in and bring in overseas people. Our universities are really struggling from the fact that students haven't been able to enter the country.
 
SMITH: But we don't need boutique quarantine headquarters when we're telling people you've got to get a negative test before you leave, you've got to be double vaccinated. And then you got to get a test when you land. Why do we need boutique quarantine once we put those protocols in place, which we've got in place now?
 
ALBANESE: Because for best practice, Chris. Over the last two years, we've had more than 20 outbreaks as a result of failures in hotel quarantine, including the big one that we've just been through in Sydney. And I'm speaking to you from Melbourne, where it shut down.
 
SMITH: But that was way before we got vaccinated to 89.5 per cent.
 
ALBANESE: Correct. But the reason why there was a problem was because of the outbreak in hotel quarantine. In that case, it was one limo driver, unvaccinated, without a mask. We needed to do two things during the pandemic that the Government got wrong. One, get the vaccines here earlier to get those vaccination rates up. And have purpose-built quarantine. And the Federal Government failed on both of those key measures.
 
SMITH: I think the whole business about boutique quarantine is useless. But let's agree to disagree. Queensland has finally opened its border. But the rules are so messy, Anthony. Tell me whether this is right. You've got a plane load of people, a person is COVID positive, the people on the plane have had a negative test, they are double vaccinated, they get a test when they land, they proved to be negative. And they still have to spend their 14 days of holidays in Queensland locked up in a hotel room. How is that living with COVID?
 
ALBANESE: Well, I travelled to Queensland very safely on Monday and back again. And I'll be back there again on Friday. The fact is that Queensland has done pretty well in keeping Queenslanders safe over this period. They haven't had to endure the sort of lockdowns that we had in Sydney. They haven't had the same restrictions that we've had in Sydney. And there are restrictions in place if you come across.
 
SMITH: You don't think that's too tough? Victoria doesn't do this. Dan Andrews has a much easier restriction protocol regime.
 
ALBANESE: Well, my son had his 21st on Saturday night, at the party. And tens of his friends couldn't come because they'd been in the same vicinity, they were deemed to be close contacts with people in a pub in the Inner West of Sydney. There are those restrictions right there in Sydney right now.
 
SMITH: Okay. Let me move on to energy. You weren't supportive of a 45 per cent emissions target by 2030. You thought it was too much when Bill Shorten was hoping to get into the Prime Minister's job. How is 43, two per cent less, perfect?
 
ALBANESE: What we couldn't do during the election campaign last time around was explaining exactly how it was going to occur. What we have put forward is a plan that will create 604,000 jobs that will reduce average power prices in the national electricity market by $275 for every household. We have a plan that will create $52 billion of private sector investment and will result in, by 2030, 82 per cent of our energy will be produced by renewable energy.
 
SMITH: You promised that you can deliver on all of that, how can you promise so far out?
 
ALBANESE: It's all been modelled. We know that the private sector wants this. Our plan, Chris, has been backed by the Business Council of Australia. They know about business. The Australian Industry Group, they know about industry. By the Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry, they know about commerce. And by the National Farmers' Federation, they know what rural Australia wants. As well as the ACTU, because we'll protect workers on the way through. This is a plan that will end the climate wars, Chris. We need to end it. We need to stop this nonsense that has gone on for more than a decade. This is a coherent plan to take Australia forward, to take advantage of the opportunities which are there. And just as many of your listeners have taken advantage, put a solar panel on their roof, have a battery, their power bills are going down. It might take four or five years to pay off, but from then, they're better off. They've done that because of economics.
 
SMITH: I actually think, yes, net zero, we've got to do our bit. But no matter what we do, and we're taking opportunities as well, there will be opportunities in this new field, but having said all of that, you have to admit we won't be changing the temperature of the planet from Australia, will we?
 
ALBANESE: Well, the whole world has to act, Chris.
 
SMITH: Until China and India does, it's a waste of time.
 
ALBANESE: Well, you're right. But until Australia joins the rest of the world, like the United States, United Kingdom, Europe, Japan, South Korea, in acting, and our plans are consistent, are actually at the lower end of what advanced economies are saying they can do because we're left with a standing start rather than a run up because this Government have had more than 20 energy policies and haven't landed one. Australia needs certainty. That's what business is crying out for. And that's why our plan has been backed by the business community.
 
SMITH: This is a very important question. In Brazil, a couple of politicians jumped into the boxing ring. There was a war of words between the two that led to a three-round boxing match. Would you get into the ring with ScoMo before the election?
 
ALBANESE: That is a rather bizarre plan and not the first bizarre plan I've heard occur in Brazil.
 
SMITH: You could do it for charity.
 
ALBANESE: I think that pugilism is something that people want less off from their politicians. One of the things that I'm saying is that we need more agreement, more of Australia coming together going forward. This bloke I'm opposing is always looking for an argument. I'm not looking for a fight. I'm looking for solutions.
 
SMITH: Alright. Good to have you on the program. We'll catch up again soon.
 
ALBANESE: Thanks very much, Chris.
 
ENDS