SUBJECTS: Visit to WA; Labor’s National Reconstruction Fund; importance of manufacturing; Scott Morrison’s lack of presence in Western Australia; importance of WA in federal politics; WA state election; Brittany Higgins; vaccine rollout; WA Labor; DJ Albo; music. 

DEAN CLAIRS, HOST: I think he's tampered with the music already. The Federal Labor Leader, Opposition Leader, Anthony Albanese, good morning.

ANTHONY ALBANESE, LEADER OF THE AUSTRALIAN LABOR PARTY: Good morning.

LISA SHAW, HOST: We've learnt that you have fantastic taste in music. But we'll get to that. First of all, what are you doing here in WA? Welcome.

ALBANESE: Well, I'm here chatting with people. Yesterday, I was at a manufacturing plant speaking about our National Reconstruction Fund to actually make more things here. One of the lessons of the pandemic is that we need to make more things here. I was up in Karratha also for a day looking at Pluto up there, projects, but also meeting with the local First Nations people on the Burrup Peninsula, looking at the rock art and the plans they have to expand tourism there. And on Sunday night, we had an event here with Mark McGowan just to say thank you to all the volunteers who worked on his campaign and will be working on my campaign. 

CLAIRS: This celebration, we saw you were pouring beers with Mark at one stage, and lots of smiles in the room. 

ALBANESE: There was very much an upbeat feeling. Every second person I ran into, it seems, had just been elected into Parliament. It is quite a remarkable result.

CLAIRS: There are so many people in the room there staring at Mark from the other side. There's so many from Labor sitting there.

SHAW: No one has ever seen, really, what's happened. He's a bit of a rockstar, Mark McGowan.

ALBANESE: Nothing like that has happened in New South Wales politics, I've got to say.

SHAW: Is it a bit bemusing to be on the east coast watching this guy?

ALBANESE: I've got to say, I was over here during the campaign. And I met with Mark during that. And he was confident of winning, but very humble about it. He certainly didn't expect that outcome. 

CLAIRS: A massive landslide, wasn't it?

ALBANESE: Well, you normally expect it to sort of go back a little bit. You think that people will come back and it will be closer than the polls indicate. But, in this case, the polls were exactly right.

SHAW: Something else that was a bit unprecedented during that state election, you visited but the Prime Minister did not.

ALBANESE: No, he didn't.

CLAIRS: Apparently, he is here today.

SHAW: Even the guy standing for it said two weeks before, 'I'm not going to win'.

ALBANESE: It was a strange campaign. Scott Morrison is here today, apparently. First time in 514 days.

CLAIRS: No one's counting.

ALBANESE: I've been here eight times since Scott Morrison was last here. I enjoy coming to Perth. I think that in this big country, you've got to not just come to Perth, but go to places like Karratha and the regions. You've got to actually get a feel for what people are saying, listen to what they are telling you. And I've had that opportunity this trip and last visit. There was a bit of a gap, of course, in 2020.

CLAIRS: It was the oddest of odd years.

ALBANESE: But I did get here three times before it shut down earlier on in the year. I was reaching my target of at least 10 visits to the West every year.

CLAIRS: I want to talk about Canberra, right. Can we bring this up? Because my heart was hurting when I heard more and more about the Brittany Higgins story. And for people waking up, dragging themselves out of bed in Perth today to go and work and then pay their taxes, we don't want the House in Canberra to become the House of the Rising Sun. What's going on? And would you have addressed this totally differently to the Government?

ALBANESE: Well, it was a disgrace. The idea that the Prime Minister didn't know about a reported sexual assault 50 metres from his office is just incomprehensible. Cabinet ministers knew. Senator Reynolds' Chief of Staff at the time, of course, then went to work for him. And she was very involved in the incident but apparently didn't say anything to her boss, who she worked for before she went to Senator Reynolds and after. Other staff members knew, people in Parliament knew apparently, officials and security guards. I just find the whole incident just extraordinary. I think the one, I guess, positive to come out of it is just the sheer bravery of Brittany Higgins and the way that she's come forward has meant, I think, that other women who are victims will feel more confident about coming forward. I've had what I regard as a privilege of being outside Parliament House listening to her speech to the March 4 Justice. And she's a remarkable young woman. 

SHAW: This is why women don't come forward, of course, as we know, because it's a second-time round that you're up against it. I think Brittany took all that into account before she did this. She weighed it up.

CLAIRS: Because it's not just coming forward, it's coming forward immediately.

ALBANESE: And in coming forward, of course, women are conscious of the fact that it gets known as something that's very personal that's happened to you. And it follows you, which it will. I certainly had never met or heard of Brittany Higgins before this occurred.

SHAW: And acknowledgement of being heard, I think, is probably the most important thing.

ALBANESE: Well, it is interesting the way that Brittany has said herself that she came forward after Grace Tame was appointed the Australian of the Year and she gave that remarkable speech in accepting that honour, standing next to Scott Morrison, made Brittany Higgins think, 'Hang on, all this has gone on in Parliament House, and the Government's pretending that they're serious about this'. And quite clearly, the Government's response was totally inadequate, to say the least.

SHAW: Well, a cynical person might suggest that this is why we finally got him to visit, to get away from Canberra. Do you think that he is handling it as well as he could?

ALBANESE: No. I think that the problem for Scott Morrison is that whenever there's a crisis, I think, whether it's bushfires where he didn't hold a hose, the crisis over treatment of women where he doesn't hold an inquiry, he doesn't ask any questions, and then over the vaccination rollout where he doesn't hold the needle either. We've had different answers every day. Today it is a different answer again. What people want is just a bit of certainty and confidence that the Government knows what it is doing. Mark McGowan showed leadership during the pandemic, showed strength. And the states have basically been responsible for just about everything.

CLAIRS: Pretty much. 

ALBANESE: The only thing the feds have been responsible for, remember the app that we were all told to download? It cost taxpayers a lot of money. 

CLAIRS: That was because it was made of pop sticks and glue. Didn't really work.

ALBANESE: Completely useless. 

SHAW: The app we have got now is great.

ALBANESE: But that's a state-based one. The states just went on and did their own. They were responsible for that. They were responsible for aged care, where we saw hundreds of deaths. And they were responsible for the vaccine. And that's just been a debacle. Everyone knew that they needed to do more deals last year, but they were really complacent. And I think that's one of the things that characterises Scott Morrison, is that he just waits and waits and waits until things get worse and worse before there's any responses.

CLAIRS: And more and more Australians don't want to shake his hand. That wouldn't be good, would it? That doesn't fill me with confidence. Pfizer, you mentioned the jab, you had the Pfizer vaccine?

ALBANESE: I had the jab. I've had the two jabs. It's a good thing that people do get vaccinated. And that's the key to opening up the economy, not just keeping us healthy. But unless we fix that, our international borders will stay shut. 

SHAW: And we want to travel.

ALBANESE: We want Australians to come home. There are 40,000 stranded overseas. We want international students to be able to come here. We want to travel.

SHAW: We want to travel. Being selfish, but we want to travel.

ALBANESE: We want families to come and spend money.

SHAW: So much that we could talk about. But can we get you to hang around a bit. We'll have to have a quick break. And then we'll just lighten things up a bit.

ALBANESE: We can do that.

CLAIRS: Federal Opposition Leader, Anthony Albanese, is with us this morning.

SHAW: We are all about music, of course, here. And I've read, and tell me if I'm wrong, but I've read you really are a music fan. And I'm so impressed by some of the things that you've cited as your favourites because they're all the same as mine. The Smiths, PJ Harvey, The Triffids. Wide Open Road by The Triffids is one of my favourite songs of all time. 

ALBANESE: I actually did, coming into Perth, I did a little Insta story. Coming into Karratha, filmed and attached Wide Open Road. And my young team had no idea what it was. 'What is a Triffid?' I saw them here a long, long time ago. It was at a pub in Freo. I came across here when I was a student, had no money whatsoever, with my then-girlfriend. And we went to see The Triffids, who I had heard of but never got to see. I saw them in Sydney as well later on. But that was the first time I saw them before they were big. And then last year I was in Freo with Josh. And one of the band came up said hi. I was like wow, I saw you.

CLAIRS: Isn't that incredible? 

ALBANESE: Band members remember every gig they've done.

SHAW: And also, one of your favourite bands, we're going to play a song from them, Joy Division.

ALBANESE: Only really two studio albums. Both of them magnificent pieces of work. 

SHAW: Absolutely. 

ALBANESE: And I have them. I've got a vinyl record player in the office in Canberra. And I've got Unknown Pleasures down there at the moment. Listening to it, you get a bit late in the afternoon. It's interesting how many people don't know that Joy Division became New Order. 

SHAW: Once again, we have to educate them.

ALBANESE: I saw New Order at the Opera House a couple of years ago. 

SHAW: Really? 

ALBANESE: I have seen them a few times. Never got to see Joy Division, obviously. They never came. But when they did Joy Division songs, like Love Will Tear Us Apart, it just went crazy. Opera House, what a weird venue. New Order at the Opera House. But it's true, it happened.

CLAIRS: Is it weird to say the words 'Unknown Pleasures' when we're talking about Canberra?

SHAW: It has been a pleasure to have you come and visit us this morning. And lovely to hear about your music tastes. I am so impressed.

ALBANESE: I am just showing my age, that is what I am doing here. I DJ sometimes for charity. And for the Reclink Community Cup that plays here as well. 

CLAIRS: Please tell us that you are MC Albo.

ALBANESE: I'm DJ Albo. I'm not sure what the music industry team here is but I've DJ'd quite a few times. And I play that mainly sort of 90s, late 80s stuff, trying to educate people. I usually do Joy Division into New Order.  

CLAIRS: It's good to see you. And the fact that it's 2021, you can come and see Lisa and I, have a chat, have a bit of fun, but also, we're allowed to shake hands.

ALBANESE: It is just great to be able to come across here. I wasn't able to cross the Nullarbor for a little while. When I came across and saw The Triffids, we literally drove across the Nullarbor and back again.

SHAW: That wide open road.

ALBANESE: That was indeed a wide open road.

CLAIRS: Anthony Albanese, a pleasure. Good to talk to you.

ENDS