SUBJECTS: Doherty modelling; COVID outbreaks around Australia; lockdowns; vaccine rollout; need for national quarantine facilities; Labor’s $300 cash incentive for COVID vaccination.

DAN COX, HOST: The debate continues around the handling of the Delta outbreak in New South Wales, how it will affect the country in the weeks and months ahead. We know that in New South Wales, vaccinations are happening as fast as anywhere in the world.

JENNY MARCHANT, HOST: Yes, but the Federal Labor Leader, Anthony Albanese, thinks a cash incentive for vaccinations is needed. And he's here now. Good morning, Mr Albanese.

ANTHONY ALBANESE, LEADER OF THE AUSTRALIAN LABOR PARTY: Good morning. Thanks for having me on the program. 

MARCHANT: You think everyone fully vaccinated by the first of December should get $300? Why is that?

ALBANESE: Because it would be both a reward for those people who have already done the right thing and an incentive. Economic incentives do work. We know that Telstra are providing $200 to their employees. We know that Qantas frequent flyers are getting 1000 points, but they're getting in draws for much bigger prizes as well. And we know that around the world, economic incentives have been used and are continuing to be used. But also, our economy needs a boost. The economy is really struggling. And this $300 payment would, of course, be spent by people in local shops, stimulating the economy.

COX: Don't you think they'll just end up in our savings accounts as we sort of figure out where we're headed with jobs and casual hours and all those sorts of things? Will it really end up in the economy and stimulating it?

ALBANESE: Well, it ends up directly in the economy by giving the $300 payment to everyone across the board who's been fully vaccinated. It would provide that stimulus. We know that there's been a lot of money poured into the economy. Why wouldn't you link it to a good health outcome, which is what we're proposing? This is just a constructive idea that we've put forward in the interests of promoting vaccination rates. We know that we were running last in the developed world. Those rates are picking up. Most people are going to get vaccinated as well, without incentives. But there's also a lot of people out there who will say, 'Well, I'm going to get around to it'. What this would do is give them a bit of a hurry up and also promote discussion amongst people, amongst mates, when they can get to the pub, when they talk to each other about, 'Have you got your $300?' 'I have, why don't you go in and get vaccinated'.

MARCHANT: Anyone with a staunch opposition to vaccine, though, do you really think they'll be won over by $300? Aren't they making this decision in a very emotional sense? We know there's somebody who is opposed to being vaccinated.

ALBANESE: No, it's not aimed at the anti-vaxxers. And there are a small proportion, a very tiny proportion, of our society who don't believe in vaccinations full stop. And you're not going to win them over. What it's aimed at is promoting discussion amongst those who aren't sure. And so many people out there, I have seen a whole lot of vox pops where people go, 'Yeah, I'm going to get myself vaccinated when I'll get around to it'. And we need to get those vaccination rates up. There's a reason why vaccination rates increase when there's an outbreak, because it jogs people's memory. People go, 'Oh, there's this outbreak'. You were just speaking about one, I think, in your local community there. Where there's an infection, people do get the hurry along whenever there's a lockdown. That happened throughout New South Wales, it happened in Melbourne. How about we give people a hurry along in a positive way? And that's what this proposal is. And there's no downside. Because giving $300 to people in the economy would also boost that economy and help protect jobs.

MARCHANT: Unless it ends up with the big multinational companies or the big players in the retail sector who don't really need it, do they?

ALBANESE: Well, this is a Government that have given $13 billion of JobKeeper, at least, payments to companies that were increasing their profits. So this $300 payment would by and large be spent in local community. Some of them would go to the big companies. Some of it might be spent at your Coles or your Woolies. But it would be up to people to spend it however they chose. But a lot of it would be spent at the local cafe, the local restaurant, buying presents for the kids at Christmas. And that would be a good thing.

COX: Anthony Albanese, are you comfortable with restrictions easing and Australia moving into this next phase of the reopening plan once we reach 70 or 80 per cent vaccination rate?

ALBANESE: Yes, I am. I think you do need to have a plan going forward. And the national plan provides for easing of restrictions when you hit that 70 per cent and 80 per cent figure. And I think that is a sensible thing to do. We do need to acknowledge that there's a real impact of these lockdowns. There is a real impact on jobs and on businesses. The figures that have been agreed on as part of the national plan of 70 per cent and 80 per cent are, I think, reasonable ones.

MARCHANT: Labor leaders in other states seem nervous about staying with that plan. They feel like Delta has changed the playing field somewhat. Do you agree with them at all?

ALBANESE: Well, I don't think that’s right. I think that's a paraphrasing of Labor leaders in Western Australia and Queensland. They have been absolutely determined to keep their states safe. The plan provides for that. And there's an attempt by the Morrison Government to verbal state leaders. You need to look at what's actually written down in the plan that's been agreed to. They've said that they do agree with the existing national plan. This is a Prime Minister who's responsible, of course, for the failure of the vaccine rollout and the failure to build national quarantine. This whole outbreak arose from one limo driver in Sydney taking a foreign air crew, unvaccinated, without a mask, to hotel quarantine. And what we have now is half the country locked down as a result.

COX: Anthony Albanese, thank you for joining us on ABC Newcastle Breakfast. 

ALBANESE: Thank you very much. Bye bye.

ENDS