SUBJECTS: Unprecedented Government decision to vote against the Speaker's recommendation to refer Christian Porter to the Privileges Committee; Morrison-Joyce Government failures on climate change; Nationals holding the Government to ransom over climate change; election timing.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI, HOST: Well, as I'm sure you noted, following reports yesterday afternoon, in an unprecedented moment in the House, the Speaker of the House, Tony Smith, agreed there was a prima facie case that Christian Porter should be referred to Parliament's powerful Privileges Committee for a possible breach of disclosure rules. This in relation to the blind trust that donated money towards him towards his legal fight. But that referral suggestion to the House that they debate it, was then voted down by the Government. Joining you now is Anthony Albanese, the Leader of the Opposition. Anthony Albanese, good morning to you.

ANTHONY ALBANESE, LEADER OF THE AUSTRALIAN LABOR PARTY: Good morning, Virginia.

TRIOLI: Given the Government did defeat your push to refer Christian Porter to the Privileges Committee over the blind trust what happens now?

ALBANESE: Well, this issue now will continue to fester and be a sore on the political landscape. You can't have a circumstance whereby a Member of Parliament can receive anonymous donations for a private matter of up to $1 million and not have it declared. If this is allowed to stand, then the register of pecuniary interests, which is there as a major anti-corruption vehicle, may as well be abolished.

TRIOLI: Your Shadow Attorney General, Mark Dreyfus has referred the matter already to the Privileges Committee. What happens in that regard? They have the right and that still has authority for it to at least be considered or rejected by the Committee?

ALBANESE: Well, they do but the circumstances are now that the Parliament has already made a determination without considering the matter. And the Speaker, when he grants precedence which occurred yesterday, the Speaker has to consider under the Standing Orders, whether there's a prima facie case for it to be considered by the Privileges Committee. On that basis, never before since Federation has a Speaker's decision, determination that precedence was required, not been accepted by the House of Representatives. It's quite extraordinary to predetermine a matter and say it's not even worth examination, in contradiction of the Speaker's ruling.

TRIOLI: But in any case, as I understand the rules, it is about the Speaker determining that the matter is not frivolous, and therefore, is just rejected without the House even considering it.

ALBANESE: No, it goes even further than that, Virginia. With respect, the Standing Orders say that the Speaker must consider whether there's a prima facie case. Tony Smith takes his job very seriously. He examined the matter and determined that.

TRIOLI: But the Speaker doesn't have any direct referral power. It's simply introducing the matter into the House for the House itself to consider, and it goes where the majority numbers go.

ALBANESE: Well, the majority numbers have never before in 120 years gone against the Speaker, not once. And the reason for that is, is that it's just normally a formal process. These are certainly not normally divisions. I've had the position, of course, of Leader of the Government in the House of Representatives for six years during the Rudd and Gillard Governments. I wouldn't have even thought about doing anything other than moving a referral consistent with the Speaker's ruling, that doesn't predetermine it. But it does, it is consistent with what has happened in terms of precedence for 120 years.

TRIOLI: And what do you think now happens to the position that Tony Smith occupies in the Chair?

ALBANESE: Well, that's a matter for him. But he's been a very good Speaker. He undertakes his duties in a diligent way, and he has my respect. And it's unfortunate what happened in the House of Representatives yesterday. That should have been something that was considered by the Government.

TRIOLI: I want to move on to the issue of the Government in negotiation with their junior Coalition member, the Nationals, in coming to some sort of deal to secure a 2050 net zero emissions arrangement by early next year. What's your understanding of how those discussions are proceeding if you've got any line of sight there?

ALBANESE: Well, this is chaos. You have Bridget McKenzie yesterday in the Senate, who is the Nationals' Leader in the Senate, she's a Cabinet Minister, pretending like she's got nothing to do with the Government. You had Matt Canavan being a part of a resolution that went through the Senate yesterday, that the modelling that's been done by the Government on net zero by 2050 be tabled in the Senate today. And we'll see whether the Government complies with that Senate Order that went through yesterday. And you've got Barnaby Joyce, who famously has been a climate sceptic, has been a wrecker for his entire political career, who can't see to the end of a sentence, let alone to 2050, being in a position whereby he is pretending as well, that he's not part of the Government. This has become just a shemozzle for the Government. And you have a Prime Minister who is failing once again to lead. In this case, he's given power to the National Party.

TRIOLI: But in essence, how much does it really matter? I mean, when it comes to, for example, achieving an increase on our reduction targets, you know, in the interim measure by 2030, it clearly is state action that's going to lead the way there and actually provide that increase in the targets. And the private sector is leading the way as well, when it comes to radical, massive climate related transitions. The miners like Rio Tinto, BHP and other organisations, Fortescue Metals and many other businesses besides are investing the money in order to make the massive cuts to emissions. Does it even matter what the official Federal Government position might be leading into Glasgow?

ALBANESE: Well, it matters because the official position provides the national policy framework and what you have...

TRIOLI: Sorry to jump in there. But as I say, with the states, and with private enterprise forging ahead as they have for the last few years, in any case, aren't they providing the real leadership and reshaping the landscape here?

ALBANESE: Well, they certainly are, you're quite correct there. But imagine what could happen if you had a Federal Government that was joining with the leadership that's being shown by state governments. I must say Labor, and Coalition in government in New South Wales is showing great leadership with the renewable energy zones that they're putting in, and their targets and the policies supporting green hydrogen, supporting a range of measures, including electric vehicles. But when you have a Commonwealth Government that is failing to lead, that's holding Australia back. We're led by a guy who said that electric vehicles would end the weekend, who said that any renewable energy target was nuts, and who said it was like a bunch of Muppets.

TRIOLI: Yeah, well we're apparently in new days, and we've moved on now. But, let's get to the nuts and bolts of that. I mean, what concerns most moderate Nats to whom I speak about this is what sort of job guarantees there will be in place, given the agreement that will finally be reached? What job guarantees there will be for regional Australia in these new economies, and also in transitioning out of old energy manufacturing, what do you think they should be?

ALBANESE: Well, the point of the transition is that if you lower energy prices by adopting the cheapest form of new energy, which is renewables, then what you do is revitalise manufacturing, you change the dynamic, and that manufacturing will be located in regional Australia. Whether it's areas like green hydrogen, whether it's one of the first places I visited as Leader was the Rio Tinto aluminium refinery in Gladstone, that was looking at shifting to solar energy to power that plant so they could double their capacity. Whether you look at the Port Kembla steel works that's looking at green hydrogen, and looking at clean energy in order to not just maintain its production, but increase it in the future. The key to jobs growth is lower energy and the area which will most benefit, and all of the modeling shows this including the Business Council's modeling, but what's happening on the ground shows this as well, the big beneficiaries will be people in regional Australia because of that jobs growth.

TRIOLI: March or May do you think next year for an election Anthony Albanese?

ALBANESE: March 5th.

TRIOLI: March five? 

ALBANESE: Yep.

TRIOLI: We're writing that down. Good to talk to you this morning, Mr Albanese. Thanks for your time.

ALBANESE: Thanks very much, Virginia.


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