SUBJECTS: COVID-19; vaccine rollout; need for national quarantine; Scott Morrison failing Australians during a pandemic; Sydney lockdown; announcement of financial support during lockdowns; mixed messaging; mandatory vaccination.

PETER STEFANOVIC, HOST: Anthony Albanese, good morning. Good to see you. Did financial measures go far enough?

ANTHONY ALBANESE, LEADER OF THE AUSTRALIAN LABOR PARTY: Well, we'll wait and see. The Government needs to explain why it didn't just go back to their previous JobKeeper arrangements that we know worked in terms of wage subsidies, keeping that direct relationship between employers and employees. But it's a good thing that the Government has stepped up. Just days ago, the Prime Minister was saying that because National Accounts show that national savings have grown, then, somehow, people had a buffer. The truth is that people in Greater Sydney under this lockdown are really struggling and they need support. We welcome the fact that there has been support given. It's something that we've been calling for some time, as might I say, we called for in Victoria as well.

STEFANOVIC: This will save jobs, this will save businesses, won't it?

ALBANESE: Well, we need to save jobs and save businesses. I had a small business on the phone to me last week. They employ 20 people, they've built up their business over six or seven years, the owner was crying to me, literally just devastated and distraught thinking that he would have to lay people off. People are doing it so tough. And they're doing it tough as a direct result of the failure of the Federal Government to do the two jobs they had this year. To roll out the vaccine effectively, and to have national quarantine facilities. So therefore, the Commonwealth have an obligation to step up here.

STEFANOVIC: Scott Morrison said this morning that it is at the same level as the rate of the fourth quarter of last year. So do you think this is JobKeeper but with a different name?

ALBANESE: Well, it's not quite. And we'll see how it impacts. We want to make sure that there's no incentive there to not keep employees on. That's absolutely critical. We know that people are doing a tough in small business, we know that many individuals are doing it tough as well. One of the things that we've seen during this period of the pandemic is that some people have done okay out of it. Some businesses, including ones that received JobKeeper and never paid a back, have increased their profits, have given big bonuses to corporate executives. At the same time, it's really small business that have done it so tough. There are retail businesses in Sydney that are still open, many of the major ones. I fail to fathom how that can be the case. It is small businesses that are shut down and are really doing it difficult at this time, particularly in hospitality, but other businesses that rely upon that incoming traffic that haven't been able to adjust their business model. For them, the overheads can be maintained. So, there is a need for other measures as well. We need to make sure that businesses aren't evicted on the basis of paying their rent. We need to make sure that vaccines are available to people rather than the other way around as well, as the rollout actually increases and gets to a reasonable level. And for goodness sake, we need to do better than people queuing for hour after hour in southwest Sydney in the early hours of the morning, because they are essential workers and need to be tested every few days. We need to do better on that as well.

STEFANOVIC: I will ask you about that in a second. But I just want to get your thoughts on the stoush with the Victorian Government at the moment. It's accused the Federal Government of double standards. Do you think the Federal Government has played favourites here?

ALBANESE: Have a look at the long record of Scott Morrison's comments. The problem for Scott Morrison is, if you're a Prime Minister who has a 24-hour media time frame, who is just about short-term political management, then the contradictions in your statements are there for all to see. We're being recorded now. People will be able to look at it in a week's time. Scott Morrison seems sometimes to be oblivious to that. He's stood up and just a short time ago was praising - when we raised questions in the Parliament here when it sat, he was saying it's a good thing that New South Wales is staying open. The truth is that has created issues. And the truth is, as well, that he said that New South Wales was gold standard and that it was Victoria that lock people down as if that was an option. It hasn't been an option for any state government. Gladys Berejiklian is doing the right thing now through these constraints which are there, it's likely that they'll have to be extended. And when we moved a resolution on the floor of the Parliament expressing support for Victorians when they were going through a difficult time, Josh Frydenberg's speech was praised by some of the cheer squad in the media for its stride of nature. I thought it was appalling, and I think that Victorians thought that as well. It showed a tin ear. And again, today, I noticed in the clip that you just showed before our interview, Josh Frydenberg's language again, whilst accusing the Victorian Government of politicising the issue, he was being totally political, totally dismissive of the needs of Victorians.

STEFANOVIC: ATAGI overnight, just a couple of quick ones before we go, ATAGI has changed the advice that under-60s should consider getting AstraZeneca, just for outbreak zones, there's a shorter interval between shots. It's just for hotspots. Would you like to see that expanded?

ALBANESE: I'd like to see politicians not second guess health advice and not create more confusion. I think we should listen to ATAGI. They are the appropriate body. Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisations. I've said before, I don't have doctor at the front of my name. When comments have been made by the Prime Minister, I think it's created more confusion.

STEFANOVIC: Okay. Should vaccination be mandatory for health workers in aged care?

ALBANESE: I think that people who are working with vulnerable people should be vaccinated. The issue here is, Peter, people can't get vaccinated. Sixty per cent of aged care workers have not had their first jab. They were told they'd get it before Easter. Aged care workers, disability care workers, aged care residents, everyone in category 1A. And it just hasn't happened. Why hasn't it happened? It isn't because of reluctance. It's because of a failure of supply. Because they simply can't be vaccinated and some of this debate about compulsion, you would think, ignores that. People aren't running away from getting vaccinated. They are trying to be vaccinated and are unable to. And people in my community, in the inner west of Sydney, still, when they log on, they get given a number and they get told, 'No appointments available at this time'. That was still happening yesterday. No appointments right up until 2022. That's the problem here is that the Government botched the supply issue because they put all their eggs in the AstraZeneca basket. And the chickens have come home to roost. They met with Pfizer last July and didn't do a deal with them until November.

STEFANOVIC: But what is also a problem, I mean, is that you're calling for health workers in aged care to get vaccinated, but you've also got some Labor affiliated unions who believe that it should come down to choice. So what are you doing to bring those unions into line with your message?

ALBANESE: Peter, good try. I'm responsible for putting forward advice based upon the experts, health advice and I will continue to do that. We know that we want to encourage people to be vaccinated. I have a great deal of sympathy with officials of unions. It's as if people are blaming the workers here. The workers haven't been able to be vaccinated because the supply isn't there. I met with aged care workers last week in Redcliffe in Queensland, who were desperate to get vaccinated, who had circumstances whereby one of them had been vaccinated because there was an additional leftover when the residents at the facility that they worked at were vaccinated, but others have been desperate to. And I've met a lot of aged care workers this year. I'm yet to meet one who has said to me, 'I don't want to be vaccinated'.

STEFANOVIC: But why not say to those union leaders, 'Hey, we've got to come from the same page here. We've got to have the same message'?

ALBANESE: Peter, the message is that of course people should be vaccinated. The Federal Government has failed to supply vaccines to vaccinate people. That's what's happened here and let's not get distracted by anything else other than that. This is an issue of supply. The supply isn't there. You can't give people a vaccine if you don't have it. Yesterday, I was there at Wavell Heights in Brisbane. What we had there was a GP facility that had set itself up for 700 vaccines a week at minimum. They bought fridges, they invested in the capital. And guess what? They're getting 150 AstraZeneca a week. That's what they're getting. And aged care workers who were told they'd be vaccinated, were told by the Government, 'Go and fix it yourself'. So, the truth is that the Federal Health Department that regulates and funds aged care can't tell you precisely how many aged care workers have been vaccinated because they weren't responsible for the program. They said, 'Go and look after yourself. Go see your local GP'. When aged care workers went to their local GP, they were told, 'Sorry, we're just unable to vaccinate you because we don't have a vaccine'. My own GP had people queue up, when the announcement was made about the rollout of the vaccine, outside the medical facility. They didn't have any vaccines at that point in time. This is a story that has been told right around the country. And that's the issue here.

STEFANOVIC: Okay, Anthony Albanese. We're out of time. Appreciate your time this morning, though. Talk to you soon. 

ALBANESE: Thanks very much, Peter.

ENDS